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Grey
Lurker
Joined: Mon Jan 11, 2010 5:51 am Posts: 7
Gender: Not Telling
Type: Mixed
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 Re: demon gods?
I thought the seelie and unseelie courts are categories that are derived from Scottish folklore and that Shakespeare based the fairies of A Midsummer Night's Dream upon it. I'm sure it's Scottish in origin.
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| Thu Jan 28, 2010 7:53 pm |
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Lopting
Moderator
Joined: Tue Mar 03, 2009 10:41 pm Posts: 1461
Gender: Not Telling
Type: Human
Specific: Wolf
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 Re: demon gods?
I may be misinformed on this subject, but to my knowledge there were no mentions of seelie of unseelie courts before midsummer's night's dream.
_________________ 'Meanwhile, in The Nevermind:'
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| Fri Jan 29, 2010 12:17 am |
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Lhene
Master
Joined: Wed Mar 04, 2009 9:01 am Posts: 1893 Location: Canada
Gender: Female
Type: Fae
Specific: Leshy
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 Re: demon gods?
Lopting wrote: I may be misinformed on this subject, but to my knowledge there were no mentions of seelie of unseelie courts before midsummer's night's dream. But Midsummer Night's Dream never mentions the seelie and unseelie. There are two different courts, yes, but they're not specified as "good" or "bad" or any of that. Just different factions of Faerie.
_________________ "Life is never fair, and perhaps it is a good thing for most of us that it is not." - Oscar Wilde
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| Sat Jan 30, 2010 4:27 am |
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Grey
Lurker
Joined: Mon Jan 11, 2010 5:51 am Posts: 7
Gender: Not Telling
Type: Mixed
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 Re: demon gods?
Puck is a hobgoblin, which are creatures of the seelie court; but keyword searching online postings of the whole of A Midsummer Night's Dream yields no results for "seelie" or "unseelie". Wikipedia [an unreliable source though, obviously - and perhaps you just meant the "good" and "bad" division and the idea of there being two groups of fairies] states that they are "derived from Scottish folklore".
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| Sun Jan 31, 2010 3:27 am |
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likeuntoaleopard
Donor
Joined: Sat Jan 09, 2010 8:24 am Posts: 181
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 Re: demon gods?
That's where I first heard the terms as well. Scottish folklore. Though I can't say any faekin I know ascribe to any one of them, save in reference to a "past life." I would imagine once souls move on to new lives they may not be in the right place or time (or remember where they were -- though a friend of mine said they were Scotland, somewhere in the Moors, could just be local legend, nothing concrete) to carry on old affiliations.
_________________ /l、 ゙(゚、 。 7 l、゙ ~ヽ じしf_, )ノ Mew
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| Sun Jan 31, 2010 3:38 am |
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Harbinger-Shinigami
Donor
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2010 4:30 pm Posts: 132 Location: plymouth el paso- IN/TX
Gender: Male
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 Re: demon gods?
Lopting wrote: There's another fun thing: The seelie/unseelie courts have been invented by William Shakespeare; they weren't there, before. So since they don't appear in mythology, I think it's safe to say they shouldn't be referenced as... Ehm.. Actual.
After all; the Forgotten Realms setting has a lot to say about all sorts of species... Hardly good material to stave a spirituality on, though. so your saying that the heirarchies of angels and demons dont exist but were made up by shakespeare... right?
_________________ let a man never stir on his road without his weapons of war; for unsure is the knowing when need shall arise of a spear on the way, without. -Odin
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| Sun Mar 07, 2010 9:26 pm |
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noumenon
Fledgling
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2010 4:27 pm Posts: 629 Location: Backwoods of Pennsylvania
Gender: Not Telling
Type: Angelic
Specific: Shifty Celestial
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 Re: demon gods?
Harbinger-Shinigami wrote: Lopting wrote: There's another fun thing: The seelie/unseelie courts have been invented by William Shakespeare; they weren't there, before. So since they don't appear in mythology, I think it's safe to say they shouldn't be referenced as... Ehm.. Actual.
After all; the Forgotten Realms setting has a lot to say about all sorts of species... Hardly good material to stave a spirituality on, though. so your saying that the heirarchies of angels and demons dont exist but were made up by shakespeare... right? wut? No, he's saying the seelie/unseelie fae courts were. Not saying it socially-inclined fae didn't have courts at all, but those archetype ones were fake, apparently.
_________________ Narrowly escaping OK.com's ban hammer since February 2010.
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| Mon Mar 08, 2010 1:25 am |
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Harbinger-Shinigami
Donor
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 Re: demon gods?
noumenon wrote: Harbinger-Shinigami wrote: Lopting wrote: There's another fun thing: The seelie/unseelie courts have been invented by William Shakespeare; they weren't there, before. So since they don't appear in mythology, I think it's safe to say they shouldn't be referenced as... Ehm.. Actual.
After all; the Forgotten Realms setting has a lot to say about all sorts of species... Hardly good material to stave a spirituality on, though. so your saying that the heirarchies of angels and demons dont exist but were made up by shakespeare... right? wut? No, he's saying the seelie/unseelie fae courts were. Not saying it socially-inclined fae didn't have courts at all, but those archetype ones were fake, apparently. ok thanks for clearing up my bad, i never heard of seelie unseelie courts
_________________ let a man never stir on his road without his weapons of war; for unsure is the knowing when need shall arise of a spear on the way, without. -Odin
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| Mon Mar 08, 2010 1:37 am |
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noumenon
Fledgling
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2010 4:27 pm Posts: 629 Location: Backwoods of Pennsylvania
Gender: Not Telling
Type: Angelic
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 Re: demon gods?
Yea, supposedly good and bad, quote-on-quote, fae courts. Not surprised if they were made up by Shakespeare, but I think smaller social fae could have their own courts. Or maybe they just throw epic fairy parties.
_________________ Narrowly escaping OK.com's ban hammer since February 2010.
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| Mon Mar 08, 2010 1:41 am |
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Harbinger-Shinigami
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Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2010 4:30 pm Posts: 132 Location: plymouth el paso- IN/TX
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 Re: demon gods?
i was under the impression of large fae parties lol
_________________ let a man never stir on his road without his weapons of war; for unsure is the knowing when need shall arise of a spear on the way, without. -Odin
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| Mon Mar 08, 2010 1:55 am |
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Lopting
Moderator
Joined: Tue Mar 03, 2009 10:41 pm Posts: 1461
Gender: Not Telling
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 Re: demon gods?
Quote: so your saying that the heirarchies of angels and demons dont exist but were made up by shakespeare... right? Well; no. But that was already explained. I'm afraid we simply can't say who came up with the idea that angels and demons have hierarchies; it's too long in the past. (Also meaning: No; I don't believe in those, either.) I seem to have been wrong about Shakespeare, with the (un)seelie thing, so I can't say who came up with that one, either.  But, of course, I don't believe that angels, demons, faeries, dragons and stuff exist in any way other than in folklore and otherkin. Stories and human (behavioural) psychology. I don't believe in souls, reincarnation, after-lives, invisible realms and all that jazz. So I'm posting from that point of view. It's important to know that, because I wouldn't want you to just jump to conclusions just because some person on the internet said something.
_________________ 'Meanwhile, in The Nevermind:'
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| Mon Mar 08, 2010 2:49 am |
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Harbinger-Shinigami
Donor
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2010 4:30 pm Posts: 132 Location: plymouth el paso- IN/TX
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 Re: demon gods?
eh to each their own i suppse....?
_________________ let a man never stir on his road without his weapons of war; for unsure is the knowing when need shall arise of a spear on the way, without. -Odin
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| Mon Mar 08, 2010 5:12 am |
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Lopting
Moderator
Joined: Tue Mar 03, 2009 10:41 pm Posts: 1461
Gender: Not Telling
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 Re: demon gods?
Yeah; to each their own. I just think it's best to always cover all possibilities, and then make up your mind about things. As you can see, it's impossible to get all your facts straight, but yeah..
It still makes for a fascinating study.
_________________ 'Meanwhile, in The Nevermind:'
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| Mon Mar 08, 2010 5:39 am |
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Harbinger-Shinigami
Donor
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2010 4:30 pm Posts: 132 Location: plymouth el paso- IN/TX
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 Re: demon gods?
ya i try to take the best of all the religions lol... and work it in. idk its wird but its mine.
_________________ let a man never stir on his road without his weapons of war; for unsure is the knowing when need shall arise of a spear on the way, without. -Odin
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| Mon Mar 08, 2010 5:42 pm |
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Harbinger-Shinigami
Donor
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2010 4:30 pm Posts: 132 Location: plymouth el paso- IN/TX
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 Re: demon gods?
thats fucked up dude.
_________________ let a man never stir on his road without his weapons of war; for unsure is the knowing when need shall arise of a spear on the way, without. -Odin
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| Thu Mar 18, 2010 3:09 am |
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